Dying to Know: Ram Dass and Timothy Leary

Interesting interview with Garcia when asked about what Ram Dass called him:

https://halmasonberg.wordpress.com/2012/08/07/jerry-garcia-week-2012-day-7-ram-dass-remembers/

Thanks for the recommendation, Rik, and the interview, jg8142.

Pretty awesome article, thanks!

wouldn't mind checking out the documentary either.

Interesting, I was just having a conversation with a friend about Richard Alpert/Ram Dass and Andrew Weil last night while at the Damian Marley show.  He claimed that Weil was the snitch that brought down the program at Harvard.  He said that Leary and Alpert had been given the go-ahead to conduct their research trials with the agreement that no one below the Graduate Studies level would be allowed to participate.  Weil was refused entrance into the study because he was an undergrad, then got all butt-hurt when he discovered that Alpert had allowed an undergrad male student he was having an affair with to participate.  Weil reported this to the Harvard admin and they shut the program down.  Does the documentary cover and/or Weil speak to any of this?

Oddly, I also sold a 6 LP box set of chants and conversations of Dass we've had sitting around for some time yesterday afternoon to some cat up from L.A. for the show.  The concert was fairly pedestrian, but notable in that some woman's water broke in the first row of the balcony and she gave birth in the ladies room during the show.   

Somebody traveled from l.a. To Seattle to see Damian Marley?

I think so.  Two guys actually.  They own an independent experimental record label, so maybe they were on a business trip.  They were going to the show.  I didn't grill them.

my buddy's neighbor in town is a  guy in his 70's? from ny originally. well he got busted with the reefer back there in the day and spent 6? mos in jail. i forget. but he was in at the same time as leary, somewhere in i guess, in upstate ny. 

said leary's gf at the time wrote him letters that were dipped. he spent like half his sentence trippin' in prison...

VERY intelligent master electrician. fascinating fellow.

i'll check the doc.

also just finished netflix george harrison doc, which i thought was very good.

..

Much thanks for the heads up on the Doc and the interview link. Can't wait to check them out!!!

just read a good book on this topic...

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6919981-the-harvard-psychedelic-club

Spent 6 hours yesterday with someone who's claimed to have participated in clinical trials, but he didn't go into specifics as to when or where.   I was trying to help him either book a plane ticket back home to LA (since he doesn't use computers) and/or give him a ride up a jeep road to find another spot to camp.   He used to live in Telluride about 10 years ago, and just showed up in town about a month ago after visiting Burning Man for the first time ... and has been camping in the area.

For one reason or another, I seem to be able to relate to most people who are "crazy" to one extent or another ... although typically I don't view said people through such a lens, and often hear at a later date only to learn about their local moniker such as "Crazy Patrick".   The interesting thing about this person is that he had immediately struck me as someone who's been vigilant to remain on an interpersonal journey of "exploration" re: the mind and existential issues ... in way that conjures up thoughts related to the intersection of such with a western scientific paradigm ... along the lines of Leary, Dass, etc.   It's almost as if he was once literally one of them -- being very well spoken and read, as well as being able to think out of the box re: that which is not always attainable to 99.9% of people.  It almost seems as if he got kicked out, or was quietly "released" from a related university department or program ... and has been on his own journey ever since.   While I was speaking with him on the street a couple weeks ago, another local (who's also a long time head) meets up with us and immediately "jumps in where they left off" on some heavy existential topic.  Not that I needed it, but it sort of served as an "external confirmation" about this person's perspective being very interesting to say the least.

I always knew he had issues "functioning" in every day society, but until yesterday I was unaware of the extent of which and part of the nature ... a good part is related to OCD.   All joking aside (related to my previous posts re: silverware @ restaurants), I had no idea just how powerful of a hold this condition can have over someone!  It was mindblowing to witness and be a part of his struggle first hand.  I was trying to help by giving him a ride up to a higher elevation to find a camping spot ... since he had a bunch of gear and stuff that was kind of falling out all over the place and he just didn't appear to have his shit together in this capacity.   However, he was clearly reluctant to have me pull my car around to give him a ride & I asked why, and he basically responded with a quick synopsis of his OCD and how he couldn't leave his current spot until various vehicles that had pulled up recently nearby had left.  Likewise, whenever a new vehicle pulled up without an old one leaving, it "reset" the counter ... so as the new vehicle also had to leave.  He admitted this was irrational and was clearly struggling with being able to deal with this ... so I didn't want to push him, but another hour went by and I needed to be on my way ... so tried to persuade him to try and leave if he felt comfortable in doing so.   The weather has been pretty bad recently, so was really trying to just see that he found a new spot to camp and not "out there".   He clearly understood and accepted my practical "arguments", but at the same time couldn't break free of the OCD issues.  I didn't want to pressure him, but was trying my best nudge him in a safe practical direction ... although still wasn't sure if what I was doing was bad in a way akin to ":waking up a sleep walker"?  By the same token, I didn't want to enable him by waiting until his OCD gave a green light ... aside from me just needing to be on my way.  He eventually relented and got in my car even though there was a parked truck that "needed to leave".

So, after driving him up a jeep road and looking into some spots to camp, he became indecisive about which campsite would work best ... and then admitted that he was still worried about "that damn truck" (that was still parked) and said he'd probably need to walk all of his crap back down to town and then walk all the way back up as sort of a "repentance" (for leaving before the truck left).    However, he was clearly struggling with this and was trying his best to "fight" the OCD battle in his mind.  I was kind of surprised to see him finally (after 6 hours) pick a spot to camp and give it a try -- instead of immediately heading back down to town and starting over ... although he did say there was a strong likelihood that he might still do so after I had left.   Another particular compulsion that he admitted to was to withhold urination until he felt a sense of "completion" (with respect to other OCD "assignments" he's established for himself) ... so that was very painful to watch.

After a certain point, I realized there was only so much I could do ... and needed to extract myself from the situation for the day.  Even after witnessing some of this person's "dirty laundry", it did not detract one bit from the sense of "enlightenment" I perceive from him.   It's an interesting juxtaposition & do feel a kinship to it ... although have somehow managed to stay on this side of the "functionality" line ... which probably entails relinquishing a bit on the "enlightenment" side of the line.   Is it rare to find people who manage to integrate extreme existential enlightenment and remain highly functional?    Woke up still exhausted from this experience & saw this thread again in a different light.    Anyone have any words of wisdom re: OCD?

You may want try DeCaf next time.

Strong work face 

 Fascinating       And also sounded like a nice journey for your mind

Barbara Meier: You don’t impose any political message.

Jerry Garcia: I couldn’t do it. The power is frightening.

Barbara Meier: Are you ever tempted?

Jerry Garcia: No. I thought, if I’m going to be onstage I’m not going to say anything to anybody or address the crowd, because it doesn’t matter what you say, sometimes just the sound of your voice might inadvertently set somebody off. The situation with psychedelics is so highly charged that you never know what’s leaking in. I don’t mind doing it in the music, because that’s where I divest myself of ego. It’s egoless, something I trust. If the band has something to protect, it’s the integrity of the experience, which remains shapeless and formless. As long as it stays that way, everything’s okay.

If only more people felt this way.  Boy do I miss that guy.

Just

Say

Know

Fascinating       And also sounded like a nice journey for your mind<<<

It is extremely fascinating, to say the least.  I suppose it does provide a journey for my mind in various ways ... especially in so far as illustrating how one's mind can operate in a "self defeating" manner.  However, it begs the question re: what is "non self defeating"?  I suspect some mild compulsions might serve a "secondary purpose" and could simply be a residual reflection of how our minds are subject to "Newtonian" mechanics. 

After spending time with him the other day, I've noticed several of my small compulsions.  When I close my garage door, I always wait inside to visually comfirm it's closed.   The "practical" reason I tell myself is there are many porcupines that have been attracted to my garage (to eat at the wood siding) and don't want one to sneak inside when I'm unaware.  I know this is very unlikely, but an even more "unlikely & out there" reason is to insure a person isn't hiding nearby ready to dart inside the garage.  I know this is extremely unlikely and "irrational" (especially with the laser trip), but the thoughts exist & I normally follow through with the compulsion ... and if I don't, I might go back and check on the garage.  Another is double/triple checking that all appliances have been properly shut down before going to sleep or on a trip.  I've adopted somewhat of a "flight check" routine; however, I've driven back to my home (from no more than a few minutes away) to double check if I'm not certain.  The other side of the coin:  in the past, I've found myself inadvertently leaving the stove top or coffee maker on or the garage door open overnight by mistake ... and realize that thc can contribute greatly to this.  Neither of these compulsions take control of my life and typically are just miniscule blips overall, but they're still there ... and provide at least some small insight into someone who's life is bound by obsessive / compulsive behavior.

I can't help but wonder if this person's OCD somehow allows him to "free his mind" in ways that would otherwise be impossible?  I'm not sure and now curious if he participated in the clinical trials because he had OCD (and was seeking a remedy) ... and kind of stumbled onto a path of enlightenment?   He explained it was one of the most profound experiences he's ever had involving a very high dose of pure acid while under visual sensory deprivation and wearing headphones that played music ... resulting in an "inward journey".  After a certain point, he believed the music and his mind "melded into one".  He's also talked about psychedelic experiences with DMT and other substances, but not sure if they were also clinically related.  I know he's now considering going to Tijuana to participate in some sort of treatment that utilizes ibogaine ... hoping it'll help with OCD.

I popped into the post office yesterday and I saw him standing in the center of where customers congregate & we waved hello from a distance, but I opted to leave immediately ... somewhere in the back of my mind I didn't want to admit that he was in the midst of another OCD episode & was still drained from my experience with him the day before.   At the same time, I had to resist an urge to back and see if it was true.  However, later in the day, I recalled our mutual friend mentioning the post office is one of his "spots" re: OCD behavior ... actually just got off the phone with one of the postal workers I know to give him a heads up to try and give this person some slack if at all possible.