12 dead in LA...yawn

South parks first episode this season nails it.

It’s probably because of rap music and video games

No

it's the NRA puppets

It was at a country music bar.  Maybe the dude really hated country music or perhaps he was jilted by a woman there.   Hard to know what makes these assholes tick.  They still don't know why that guy shot up the country music fest last year.

>>>>>They still don't know why that guy shot up the country music fest last year.

because guns are super easy to get and he could

We really should focus more on the how than the why.

Can't remember the last mass shooting that wasn't perpetrated using a legally bought firearm.   But those pesky criminals, they don't obey those laws!!  

When's the last time someone robbed a convenience store and shot up the place with an AR15?  

And the NRA will answer with 'if everyone had guns that would have been the perfect time to shoot him!'  As though real life is some sort of spaghetti western.  

White male, David Long,  28(?)

.  

>>> We really should focus more on the how than the why.

Agreed.

People have a hard time grasping that concept while they polish their multiple AR-15s.

Now where is that NRA shill Ender?

>>>We really should focus more on the how than the why.

I don't her enough about either.

our society is very ill.

Can't help but notice one of the folks in a picture is wearing a hoodie for a company called "Black Rifle Coffee Brewers".  Ugh.

https://www.npr.org/2018/11/08/665540820/multiple-injuries-in-shooting-a...

..cause.... GUNS... and COFFEE!!!

Glock was used with a possible 30 round "extended MAGAzine" that could be replaced by another 30 round "extended MAGAzine in seconds.

How?   .45 Glock handgun with an extended mag like this:

Ridiculous.  BTW - aside from being the weapon of choice of gangstas and criminals, the Glock has been used in many of the worst mass shootings like Virginia Tech, the Ft. Hood shooting, and the Luby's massacre.   Easily concealable and packing a lot of firepower.

Why?

Dude was a former Marine with PTSD.  The cops have had some interactions with him before, including during a mental health incident a few years back.  One reasonable gun law that some states are implementing allows courts to confiscate firearms of a person who is deemed to be a threat to themselves or others generally.  Traditionally, for the cops to be able to seize someone's firearms, there has to be some sort of domestic abuse or stalking order. 

>>> Dude was a former Marine with PTSD

He was a former Marine.

Where did you get the PTSD info?

The incident last Spring (cops called about a disturbance at his residence) where they said he was acting irrational, so they call in the

emergency health team, they found no reason to take him in for Mental Health evaluation, he had calmed down.

His other run ins with the law were traffic incidents.

He was on NO mental health list that would bar him from getting a gun.

His gun was legal, the MAGAzine was illegal.

TERRIBLE ! Close To Home ! Harsh

>>>He was on NO mental health list that would bar him from getting a gun.

Right.  Under current laws in most states, one has to be formally adjudicated as being mentally ill to be barred from purchasing firearms.   

In this case, the guy had not been formally adjudicated as being mentally ill, but neighbors said he had PTSD and very bad anger problem, would kick in the walls, etc.  The cops who came to his house last year also said they thought he had PTSD but the situation wasn't bad enough to take him on a 5150.   

Under some new laws enacted in Washington State and elsewhere, if someone is acting all scary and crazy like that, they can petition a court to have their firearms seized without a conviction of domestic abuse or a formal adjudication of mental illness.

>>> In this case, the guy had not been formally adjudicated as being mentally ill, but neighbors said he had PTSD and very bad anger problem, would kick in the walls, etc.  The cops who came to his house last year also said they thought he had PTSD but the situation wasn't bad enough to take him on a 5150

Ken, you posted he had PTSD.

Asked where you got that info...

And you say his neighbors diagnosed him?

You're a real time lawyer, how in the fuck do you think that's gonna fly? 

The neighbors said so, really?!

JFC!!!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hxl9R_2ax-8

Neil Young "Ohio", official video.

Too much madness.  How many more?  

Love to all of the victim's families and peace on all the departed souls.

TOD, are you arguing there’s no way this guy had PTSD?  Because it reads like you’re doing that and very passionately.  I’d say chances are pretty good that could be one of this guys multiple issues.

>>>>>>how in the fuck do you think that's gonna fly? 

lol

Fly where?  Did you forget where you’re posting?

Hey genius, he said "Dude was a former marine with PTSD"

Asked where he got that PTSD info.

He says this:

In this case, the guy had not been formally adjudicated as being mentally ill, but neighbors said he had PTSD and very bad anger problem, would kick in the walls, etc.  The cops who came to his house last year also said they thought he had PTSD but the situation wasn't bad enough to take him on a 5150

He declared he had PTSD according to this^^^

I know you once said "TOD, you just look stupid, did you know Ken's a real lawyer"

Just remember, it was you Timmy Hoover that brought it to my attention that he's a lawyer.

I said IDGAF if he is.

Go ahead and look it up.

If that's his "real time" lawyer stance on my question?

JFC!

4.4

>>>>>>He says this:

In this case, the guy had not been formally adjudicated as being mentally ill, but neighbors said he had PTSD and very bad anger problem, would kick in the walls, etc.  The cops who came to his house last year also said they thought he had PTSD but the situation wasn't bad enough to take him on a 5150

Yes, he said exactly what has been reported.  The guy was never diagnosed with PTSD but his neighbors said he had it.  What’s inaccurate about that?  What part doesn’t “fly”? 

I'm cool as Paul...

I don't know about y'all.

Thanks for helping me make my point again Hoover.

Fuck the NRA!

Pentagon file on this guy sounds like he could have had PTSD.

I don't like or own a gun.

Fuck NRA and Fuck guns.

What's your point, TOD?

Maybe he has PTSD, maybe he doesn't. It really doesn't change what he did, or why he did it, or how he did it.

Ok.  I don't want to distract from the conversation, so I will retract the following statement:   "Dude was a former Marine with PTSD"

I should have said "Dude was a Marine veteran who served in Afghanistan and is suspected by law enforcement and neighbors as having suffered from PTSD."

Hope this clarifies things and I apologize for the confusion.  Carry on.

>>>>>>>I know you once said "TOD, you just look stupid, did you know Ken's a real lawyer"

Just remember, it was you Timmy Hoover that brought it to my attention that he's a lawyer.

What does Ken being a lawyer have to do with anything in this thread?  What legal argument are you assuming was being made?  Nowhere in this thread is the subject about any sort of legal battle or argument.  The suspect is dead.  And most likely had PTSD.

Slack- Maybe he did or didn't, I didn't argue that either way, but Ken based it on a neighbor's statement.

A different neighbor claims to be good friends with the shooters mom, says "he's a quiet loner that was rarely seen in the neighborhood"

Neither neighbors are qualified to diagnose the guy with having or not having PTSD.

That was my point, again.

>>>>>>Neither neighbors are qualified to diagnose the guy with having or not having PTSD

You don’t need any qualifications to diagnose PTSD.  You only need qualifications to prescribe medication for it.

>> That was my point, again. <<

Again, this point of fact is a minor fact in the grand scheme. Can we move on (please)?

ToD is cringe worthy. jesus christ indeed. 

T, i thought you had to have a gun to live in FL?

i prolly would.

You're right Ned.

I was told by Hoover that I looked stupid once for arguing with a REAL lawyer.

My point has been made, even real lawyers get it wrong, especially self admitted multiple AR-15 owners that spew shit like above before ACTUAL evidence is provided.

Other people can believe that because he's a lawyer... It has to be true.

Condolences to all affected.

Fuck the NRA!

Dude, get a grip. Why do you care what Hoover says? Bad zoning.

Plenty of "normal" people own guns. Ken seems pretty damn normal and stable....more stable than you're acting.

Moving on, here are some links to what I was getting at about new proactive "red flag" laws that make it easier to seize firearms from people who appear to pose a risk of harm but have not been formally adjudicated as being mentally ill or convicted of felonies or domestic abuse, which are some of the traditional barriers to purchasing firearms under the current federal background check system:

https://www.oregonlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2018/09/46_oregonians_guns...

https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/washington-among-5-states-that...

Only a handful of states, including Oregon and Washington, have such "red flag" laws and considering how many of the perps in these types of high profile mass shootings have displayed troubling warning signs, it would be a good thing for other states to consider adopting as well.

but obamma?

Tod, what are we allowed to spew here? 

ken makes me feel better about lawyers and guns.

Ned - Ken is once again, time after time, shaping the narrative that it's not guns/reasonable gun control, this time it's PTSD.

It's never the easy access to guns (go ahead look it up)

It's always the shooters fault, not the NRA shaped gun laws.

All I've been saying is that a "real lawyer's" words can be taken as the gospel.

You do know there's more than just the 20 people who post regularly on Viva who read this right?

Should Hoover have ever brought up the lawyer fact?

You're right bad zoning^^^

Im sure Ken appreciated that.

But here we are.

Fuck the NRA!

>>>I was told by Hoover that I looked stupid once for arguing with a REAL lawyer

Now you look stupid twice. 

Keep up the good work, Todd.

>> All I've been saying is that a "real lawyer's" words can be taken as the gospel. <<

I assume that's a typo.

Who thinks that a lawyer's word is gospel? I don't know one person that thinks this way. Thanks for the tip, though.

Here you go lil buddy.

gos·pel

/ˈɡäspəl/

noun

the teaching or revelation of Christ.

"it is the Church's mission to preach the gospel"

synonyms:Christian teaching, Christian doctrine, Christ's teaching; More

a thing that is absolutely true.

noun: gospel truth

"they say it's sold out, but don't take that as gospel"

synonyms:the truth; More

Who says you can't learn something on DBMB.

Oof. Make that thrice. 

Good stuff 

Tod, do you think Robert Mueller owns the same guns used by mass shooters. 

tod, do you tuck your shirts in?

>>>>>tod, do you tuck your shirts in?

Into his tighty whiteys.

..

Is TOD really ChiKev?

Where's Mattson?

12 people had their lives taken last night due to gun violence and you're actually fantasizing about me in tighty whiteys?

Wow.

Fuck the NRA and their apologists!

>>>>12 people had their lives taken last night due to gun violence and you're actually fantasizing about me in tighty whiteys?

Wow.

lol

TOD is this shooting going to get in the way of your investigation of President Trump?

^^Tod, do you think Robert Mueller owns the same guns used by mass shooters. 

Probably old school with a .38 revolver in an ankle holster.

That's how my uncle rolls.

Tod, yawn. 

>>> Ned - Ken is once again, time after time, shaping the narrative that it's not guns/reasonable gun control, this time it's PTSD.

lots of rigamarole would have been avoided if you would have said this at the start.

we're not mind-readers, ya know

This is a philzone thread were all the cool kids pile on.  No?

I think T.O.D is upset because he probably failed the bar exam.

Disclaimer on my edit....  

Jonas, is tod the only zoner that cares? 

dorkstar orchestra?

>>>This is a philzone thread were all the cool kids pile on. 

With Sixxy's annual hiatus from zoning (the winter months are always difficult for him), and 6ravy & Fo6 largely relegated to the garbage zone; I think it's fair to crown TOD the Zone's current Community Punching Bag.

Dude gets annihilated everytime he posts. 

jonas is no chonks.

Mark -- I think we all agree that a better system of gun control is in order?  TOD might not be saying it in a way that we can all agree on but the goal is the same.  

And Turtle...   Be good man. 

We're all in this together.  

 ^^^I think we all agree that a better system of gun control is in order? 

Great idea!! Let's start with Chicago.

https://heyjackass.com/

>>>>>>Great idea!! Let's start with Chicago

Okay.  If there were stricter federal regulations that improved the current lax laws in Indiana it would do a bunch to address illegal guns in Chicago.  All illegal guns start out as a legal gun.

States with stronger gun regulations have fewer deaths per capita than states with looser laws.  Indiana has more than Illinois that state that Chicago is in.

Yo, this is bullshit:
>>> With Sixxy's annual hiatus from zoning (the winter months are always difficult for him), and 6ravy & Fo6 largely relegated to the garbage zone; I think it's fair to crown TOD the Zone's current Community Punching Bag.

Dude gets annihilated everytime he posts.  <<<

Creating and sustaining this community involves respect and tolerance towards one another.  If you don't like an opinion or post, discuss it, stay on topic, don't belittle or berate someone on a personal level.... It's crap and wrong that this is the way zoners are being treated. If you need a punching bag, go to the gym, this isn't it.

What about the current batch of criminals with guns?

Will they be nice boys and turn them in?

A new law will accomplish shit.

Lets start with the illegal guns on the street.

New laws in states with poor laws will make a difference but nice try at changing the subject after I directly answered your flippant comment about Chicago.

Laws limiting access to or limiting the number of guns a person can own would have a direct impact on the flow of guns to the black market.  

Let's start with stronger, well-thought out laws.

>>>> Lets start with the illegal guns on the street.

we'll deal with that leaking dam later, right now we need to clean up all this water.

Judit’s right. From his Zoning style it’s pretty clear that  TOD has already suffered at least one too many blows to the head.

^^New laws in states with poor laws will make a difference but nice try at changing the subject after I directly answered your flippant comment about Chicago.

Ok, if Chicago upsets you..how about Baltimore?

https://thefederalistpapers.org/us/baltimore-md-highest-per-capita-gun-h...

>>>>>>how about Baltimore?

Derp.

Like I already said federal gun restrictions would slow the flow of guns to the black market.  It’s the same for any city you want to choose.  More social welfare programs to help lift people out of poverty would help too.  I’m sure you’re in favor of that being the zones resident African American advocate.

Also: https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-federalist-papers-project/

Yeah, no shit.

Mulemuzik wants to stop and frisk people. Ask him who he'd stop and frisk.

"Bias: Extreme Right, Conspiracy, Some Fake News"
 

^^ What about the current batch of criminals with guns?

Will they be nice boys and turn them in?

A new law will accomplish shit.

Lets start with the illegal guns on the street.^^

I’m going to try and answer this as nicely as possible. This argument is an argument against every law ever written. For some reason only gun control laws need to be 100% perfect. They need 100% compliance to be considered, and most important of all they can never ever, under any circumstance, inconvenience a law abiding gun owner, even if the gun owner is mentally ill.

Only in America do we have to consider whether we will inconvenience gun owners in our efforts to prevent children from being murdered.   

Birthday threads

RIP threads

Cooking threads

> Ask him who he'd stop and frisk.<

um angry white guys with pipe bombs and glocks?

Just Watched a CHILLING Video With Sound - My God A Glock  Is A SCARY Freaking Weapon !   This  Tragedy Happened Not Far Away From Me and TARWs Backyard - Just Up The Grade   in T.O. = Way WAY Harsh !

 and Now A Big Fire In The Area Too.

>>Yo, this is bullshit

Get a cat, Judit. 

st. mark, that behavior is turning away would-be zoners in droves.

I know, Turts. I'm a bad zoner.

Hey Mark...I'm going to the Voodoo Dead gig tomorrow at the Gothic if you're up for it. We can berate each other; then buy each other drinks.

That sounds likes a fun time, Ned. Please shoot me a note, let's put it together.

^^^Mulemuzik wants to stop and frisk people. Ask him who he'd stop and frisk.

Bloomberg and Giuliani.

Ned's pre-snub is pretty transparent here.

I tuck my shirts in.

Like any self-respecting 58-year-old should.

This perp had an Affliction shirt on in his photo.

Heard an interview from on of the victim's father.  Heartbreaking.

As Soon As Borderline Bar and Grill Re Opens I Am Going There ! and Buying The First 12 College Kids that Walk In I AM Buying Their First Round ! Neighbors Tragedy - Too Close to Home

and A Big One For VCSD Helus ! An American HERO 805 {{{ Kids having Fun }}}

strange gesture,  slow down PLF 

maybe donate to a charitable cause of your choice , at least think about it