I once met Merl at The Fillmore in San Francisco in the 1990s. I asked him "What really went down at The Bottom Line the night John Lennon showed up fpr a JGB gig?" (I've heard conflicting stories).
Merl said, "Ah, you'll have to wait for my book to come out..."
why did merl and jerry stop playing together? how come fierro didn't play w/ jerry after 75? did he?
There's some good discussion about all this on the Dead research blogs, but in short, Jerry had his own trajectory. And when it coincided with others, the others tended to expect it to last forever because the experience was so satisfying to all involved, including the audience.
But Jerry was in a constant state of evolution musically and sometimes the phone just wouldn't ring to let them know about the next gig (usually John Kahn's responsibility). Jerry was notoriously uncomfortable with the business end of things when it came to personnel matters. The band would just -- poof -- dissolve and the guys would soon read about another Jerry project in the newspaper. Lots of unresolved conversations remained for years after.
And there was always pressure from the Dead camp to tamp down the completion for Jerry's time and attention.
Jerry's recreational pursuits were also changing and he certainly didn't want to be questioned about his lifestyle by his bandmates / sidemen. Merl probably didn't approve of some of Jerry's habits and Martin was perceived by some to be an accomplice (possibly a party-favor provider). Also, I can imagine the band dynamics changed when after a gig, instead of hanging out together socially and equally, one or two guys would rush off to indulge in whatever or just split, reinforcing a two tiered "social dynamic" - guys that scored /partied with Jerry (mostly John Kahn) and those that didn't.
I had the pleasure of knowing Martin (as a longtime Zero-head) and interviewing him several times for articles and he would only speak glowingly about his time with Jerry -- but for years and years they didn't talk.
Yeah thanks Alan. Awesome vids btw. My impression has always kind of been that his opportunity to become a member in Legion of Mary came mostly by way of the dead being broken up, and martin was a right guy / right place / right time kind of fit, rather than because of a more intimate and personal musical connection existing between the two.
Jerry seemed to have a lot less musical collaborations after the hiatus than before. It would make sense that his bands and management wanted to keep him on a short leash. Didn't Martin play on the 73 tour with the horns? He was in Doug sahm's band, and they opened the dead tour that year. Always appreciated his contributions to the music, and in zero too.
Merl Saunders and friends gigs were billed in the Bay Area into 1978. Not sure if Martin was a member the whole time or not, but I would think there was something of a rotating cast. It's not out of the realm of possibility that Jerry may have guested at a show or two during those years.
Thanks for the links, Alan. I'd never seen the first one before.
> why did merl and jerry stop playing together?
I won't speculate about that, but if I remember correctly, it was Merl who taught JG how to play music again when he was recovering from his first coma in 86.
Fierro is a newlywed (and expecting his first child) and attending his recent wedding and singing a few songs was none other than Robert Hunter, the Grateful Dead's long-time lyricist, and Phil Lesh, the band's long-time bassist.
"Phil and Robert are two of my best friends," Fierro said. "Phil is starting to be his old self again after the liver transplant. He has been in and out of the hospital over the last four months. He is ready to get back out and do all of the charity benefits that he does. Phil really understands and supports the call for his time.
"You know, when all the members of the Grateful Dead were out doing God knows what, Phil indulged in mostly wine. He was always a fine wine connoisseur. But I guess 15 years of drinking wine caused his liver to fail. And they say wine is good for you.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Alan R StoneSculptor
on Thursday, August 6, 2020 – 08:59 pm
Another cool video posted by
Another cool video posted by Merl Jr....
Merl Sr talks about being potentially asked to join Dead, among other topics.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPdV8KrjqO8
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Joe Buck is Back masonskids
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 06:43 am
Here is an aud tape of Jerry
Here is an aud tape of Jerry sitting in with Merl 10/3/78
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=100HDJ5sr5s
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Lance minimum goad Newberry heathentom
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 05:08 pm
All these years later, with
All these years later, with all the interest & attention, that's a video of Jerry I've never seen. Thanks for posting.
"As soon as it started sounding good... I stopped."
I fucking love that guy.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: An organ grinder’s tune Turtle
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 05:53 pm
listening to some keystone at
listening to some keystone at the moment.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: I rang a silent bell China-Rider
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 05:56 pm
File it under shit happens.
File it under shit happens.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Localcountyline Localcountyline
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 06:09 pm
Love Merl. The above is one
Love Merl. The above is one of the best posters I own.
I just found a VHS tape where he tells the news that he was booked on the flight on 9/11 that crashed in Pennsylvania,
but since he wanted to watch Monday Night Football, he left on Monday instead.
Crazyness......
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Mice elf Bss
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 06:39 pm
.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Mice elf Bss
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 06:43 pm
.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Lance minimum goad Newberry heathentom
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 06:57 pm
Merl playing with High Noon,
Merl playing with High Noon, 12/12/81...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: dj_easy_wind DJ Easy Wind
on Friday, August 7, 2020 – 07:02 pm
I once met Merl at The
I once met Merl at The Fillmore in San Francisco in the 1990s. I asked him "What really went down at The Bottom Line the night John Lennon showed up fpr a JGB gig?" (I've heard conflicting stories).
Merl said, "Ah, you'll have to wait for my book to come out..."
Still waiting.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: ogkb pyramidheat
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 12:49 am
why did merl and jerry stop
why did merl and jerry stop playing together?
how come fierro didn't play w/ jerry after 75?
did he?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Mice elf Bss
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 01:19 am
Good questions
Good questions
Martin was a regular in merl's bands, not Jerry's. He played on wake of the flood though.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: long live the dead love matters
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 06:46 am
I kinda wish I had written
I kinda wish I had written down or otherwise could remember which keystone Berkeley show I went to with Debbie around 1974
https://youtu.be/MgOilnTNqTw
Betty board here
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Alan R StoneSculptor
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 08:01 am
why did merl and jerry stop
why did merl and jerry stop playing together? how come fierro didn't play w/ jerry after 75? did he?
There's some good discussion about all this on the Dead research blogs, but in short, Jerry had his own trajectory. And when it coincided with others, the others tended to expect it to last forever because the experience was so satisfying to all involved, including the audience.
But Jerry was in a constant state of evolution musically and sometimes the phone just wouldn't ring to let them know about the next gig (usually John Kahn's responsibility). Jerry was notoriously uncomfortable with the business end of things when it came to personnel matters. The band would just -- poof -- dissolve and the guys would soon read about another Jerry project in the newspaper. Lots of unresolved conversations remained for years after.
And there was always pressure from the Dead camp to tamp down the completion for Jerry's time and attention.
Jerry's recreational pursuits were also changing and he certainly didn't want to be questioned about his lifestyle by his bandmates / sidemen. Merl probably didn't approve of some of Jerry's habits and Martin was perceived by some to be an accomplice (possibly a party-favor provider). Also, I can imagine the band dynamics changed when after a gig, instead of hanging out together socially and equally, one or two guys would rush off to indulge in whatever or just split, reinforcing a two tiered "social dynamic" - guys that scored /partied with Jerry (mostly John Kahn) and those that didn't.
I had the pleasure of knowing Martin (as a longtime Zero-head) and interviewing him several times for articles and he would only speak glowingly about his time with Jerry -- but for years and years they didn't talk.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Alan R StoneSculptor
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 10:07 am
^ completion = competition
^ completion = competition
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Mice elf Bss
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 11:10 am
My impression is that his
Yeah thanks Alan. Awesome vids btw. My impression has always kind of been that his opportunity to become a member in Legion of Mary came mostly by way of the dead being broken up, and martin was a right guy / right place / right time kind of fit, rather than because of a more intimate and personal musical connection existing between the two.
Jerry seemed to have a lot less musical collaborations after the hiatus than before. It would make sense that his bands and management wanted to keep him on a short leash. Didn't Martin play on the 73 tour with the horns? He was in Doug sahm's band, and they opened the dead tour that year. Always appreciated his contributions to the music, and in zero too.
Merl Saunders and friends gigs were billed in the Bay Area into 1978. Not sure if Martin was a member the whole time or not, but I would think there was something of a rotating cast. It's not out of the realm of possibility that Jerry may have guested at a show or two during those years.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: intentionally blank mikeedwardsetc
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 11:11 am
Thanks for the links, Alan. I
Thanks for the links, Alan. I'd never seen the first one before.
> why did merl and jerry stop playing together?
I won't speculate about that, but if I remember correctly, it was Merl who taught JG how to play music again when he was recovering from his first coma in 86.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Alan R StoneSculptor
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 02:01 pm
From 1998 interview with
From 1998 interview with Martin (not mine):
Fierro is a newlywed (and expecting his first child) and attending his recent wedding and singing a few songs was none other than Robert Hunter, the Grateful Dead's long-time lyricist, and Phil Lesh, the band's long-time bassist.
"Phil and Robert are two of my best friends," Fierro said. "Phil is starting to be his old self again after the liver transplant. He has been in and out of the hospital over the last four months. He is ready to get back out and do all of the charity benefits that he does. Phil really understands and supports the call for his time.
"You know, when all the members of the Grateful Dead were out doing God knows what, Phil indulged in mostly wine. He was always a fine wine connoisseur. But I guess 15 years of drinking wine caused his liver to fail. And they say wine is good for you.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Def. High Surfdead
on Saturday, August 8, 2020 – 02:56 pm
I thought it was the
I thought it was the "Heineken years" ?